ext_993 ([identity profile] cesperanza.livejournal.com) wrote in [community profile] sga_flashfic2006-08-21 12:59 am

ADMIN POST: The Mission Report Challenge

Okay, this comes from an idea by [livejournal.com profile] nudaydreamer and it's like, three--three!--cool challenges in one! As she puts it:
I'd love to see a Mission Report Challenge. We all know some crazy shit happens on those other worlds, and authors could choose to a) write a (pornalicious?) Report That Will Never Actually Be Filed Because Elizabeth Would Freak Out And Such, b) write a euphemistically suggestive report that leaves those of us with dirty minds quite clear on what happened, without being explicit, or possibly c) take another author's story and write a report of type a or b for it.
Everybody got that? See, it's kind of a Document Challenge and it's kind of a Remix and it's kind of Classified and Porny--or not; it's a festival, really. Now to clarify about option c)--if you choose to write a mission report of somebody else's story, we'll ask you to credit them, but we won't require you to ask their permission Edited to add: and get their permission, or check the links below. HOWEVER, if you want to opt OUT of option c)--i.e. tell people that they can't write a mission report of your story or stories, even with credit--please leave a comment in this post ASAP. Edited to add: link to new opt-out post below! We WILL ask challenge respondents to check before posting that the writer hasn't opted out of the challenge. Edited to add: Merryish reminds me to say that it is, of course, perfectly acceptable to write a mission report on one of your own stories!

It's August 21st; stories will be due on Monday, September 4th, Labor Day, at midnight.


Edited to add: Freezing comments here: click here for a policy clarification, opt-in, and opt-out posts are above.

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[identity profile] witchofthedogs.livejournal.com 2006-08-21 12:15 pm (UTC)(link)
Opting out of "c," please.

Thank you.

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[identity profile] phiremangston.livejournal.com 2006-08-21 12:31 pm (UTC)(link)
Because Ces says so.

Sorry, but that's honestly the worst argument I've heard all day.

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[identity profile] vickysg1.livejournal.com 2006-08-21 12:36 pm (UTC)(link)
Opting out of option C too.

I found out about it thanks to [livejournal.com profile] miera_c too since I'm not a member here.

You know authors put a lot of work in their fic and saying that requesting for their permission isn't necessary is a bad idea.

(frozen comment) Re: Won't Be Joining this Comm Ever.

[identity profile] misspamela.livejournal.com 2006-08-21 12:39 pm (UTC)(link)
I just want to point out again, as I did above -- and I'm not affiliated with this community, just baffled by the response -- that the challenge is NOT to remix stories, just to write a mission report about a story. You wouldn't be *changing* the story at all.

I'm wondering if the message is getting mixed in the reaction

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[identity profile] spike21.livejournal.com 2006-08-21 12:43 pm (UTC)(link)
there is no ability like dorkability. *g*

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[identity profile] debc.livejournal.com 2006-08-21 12:47 pm (UTC)(link)
Even if "remix" isn't the exact correct word for it, my reaction would still be the same.

They're saying it's all right and perfectly acceptible to use someone else's fanfic without permission and it's not.

And honestly? I don't think "remix" is the wrong term. You're just taking someone else's fic and reworking it from a different angle, which is exactly what a remix (in as far as all the Remix challenges I've seen done before defines it) does.

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[identity profile] thefannishwaldo.livejournal.com 2006-08-21 12:59 pm (UTC)(link)
Okay, like Kyrdwyn, I am opting out of option C, unless you contact me before-hand. I'm at smallwaldo at comcast dot net or AIM 'smalwaldo'. I'm not sure anyone would really want to re-write any thing I've done, but like Mice, I don't want my work turned into Sheppard/McKay fics.

I know permission is one of those gray and touchy areas in fanfic, and always will be, since we're initially starting out in someone else's sandbox, but like so many others, I find it a little disheartening that it would be suggested that it's okay to not ask. I think most people would be flattered that someone liked a work enough to rewrite it and would *most likely* grant permission if it were saught, but now there's this big black cloud-o-doom over this challenge that's going to make this a lot less fun than it could have been.

(frozen comment) Paranoia check...

[identity profile] thefannishwaldo.livejournal.com 2006-08-21 01:00 pm (UTC)(link)
Most of my fic is posted under the LJ [livejournal.com profile] smallwaldo, so, you know... don't go saying, I didn't know Smallwaldo was you.

Again, not that I think anyone wants my stuff, but just to be sure...

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[identity profile] niennah.livejournal.com 2006-08-21 01:03 pm (UTC)(link)
I doubt people will be clamouring round to write mission reports of my fics, but I'd just like to state that I'd like to be contacted if anyone does decide they'd like to use my stuff. Just to be polite. My email address is niannah[at]gmail[dot]com.

if you choose to write a mission report of somebody else's story, we'll ask you to credit them, but we won't require you to ask their permission (though obviously, you're free to do so and it's always a good idea)

I have to admit, were I posting this challenge, I would have worded this part differently. The encouragement to seek permission should have, in my opinion, been far more strongly stated than this.

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[identity profile] seperis.livejournal.com 2006-08-21 01:18 pm (UTC)(link)
Because Ces says so.

I'm still debating how I feel about an opt-out instead of an opt-in here--but seriously, that's not a great precedent to set. No one can give permission to remix another person's story; only the author can do that.

We can come down to a simple, does the fandom author have control of their work in fandom OR the writer does not and the work is fair game at any time. Either way, Ces doesn't have the authority to open season on anyone's fic. Honestly, depending on which of the above is correct or accepted, it's either the author only or no permission required.

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[identity profile] seperis.livejournal.com 2006-08-21 01:22 pm (UTC)(link)
I think there would be less worry if this was more opt-in and less opt-out.

And no, I'm not taking a position yet on it, since I participate in remix and am hosting the challenge for DVD commentaries. I'm just thinking still. So can I please be spared some of the sarcasm being tossed out above?

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[identity profile] terrie01.livejournal.com 2006-08-21 01:29 pm (UTC)(link)
Opting out of option C. If you feel you absolutly MUST use one of my stories, you are, of course, free to contact me and try to change my mind.

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[identity profile] corinna-5.livejournal.com 2006-08-21 01:30 pm (UTC)(link)
I think the entire challenge needs a rewrite, since I've gone through the description twice and it's still incredibly unclear. Is the idea that ONLY stories in mission-report format can be submitted? Or is it that the idea of the "mission report" can be played with in the way, say "documentation" was in that challenge?

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(Anonymous) 2006-08-21 01:38 pm (UTC)(link)
Why don't you just avoid wankiness and make it opt-in? That's way smarter.

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[identity profile] mentalmichael.livejournal.com 2006-08-21 01:50 pm (UTC)(link)
The odds of anyone wanting to use one of my stories is remote, but if they do then please contact me and ask - I'd want to see it and I'd like the power to stop someone publishing it if necessary.

Really, really bad set up, by the way - I only heard about this thanks to miera_c

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[identity profile] hth-the-first.livejournal.com 2006-08-21 01:53 pm (UTC)(link)
Really? The owner of a community sets the rules, I would think. It seems like a perfectly sensible argument to me.

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[identity profile] serabut.livejournal.com 2006-08-21 01:56 pm (UTC)(link)
Automatically am opting out of option C please. But permission will be given if contacted (by email, LJTalk or y!m). This goes for any fic I've written and will write.

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[identity profile] hth-the-first.livejournal.com 2006-08-21 01:58 pm (UTC)(link)
Either way, Ces doesn't have the authority to open season on anyone's fic.

No, but she has the absolute authority to decide what may and may not be posted on [livejournal.com profile] sga_flashfic Whether or not people have a moral and ethical right to tinker with someone else's story, the simple truth is there isn't actually a fandom police and we can't stop them. What we can do, if we wish, is bar them from publishing it in certain venues to show our disapproval. That's at the discretion of community/list/archive moderators.

(frozen comment) Re: Won't Be Joining this Comm Ever.

[identity profile] kissingchaos9.livejournal.com 2006-08-21 02:00 pm (UTC)(link)
But it's not reworking it from another angle. She's not suggesting that you completely rewrite someone else's story and claim it as your own, she's suggesting you write a *mission report* of someone else's story. So, if you read astolat's Mostly Harmless, the challenge would be in writing a mission report that didn't describe John and Rodney getting blown by fluff ball aliens.

Which, heh. I'd honestly like to read that.
khriskin: (Tree bad)

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[personal profile] khriskin 2006-08-21 02:00 pm (UTC)(link)
I had a few question on this challenge as well:

A. Does it have to be in mission report format? Or can it be the team sitting around trying to write an 'acceptable' report?

A1. Where can I find a mission report format?

B. When you talk about writing report for other people's stories you mean that we need to use the story canon when we right the report... not that they should make up stuff, right? Otherwise, I'm really not thinking that's a polite idea. Not that I have anything worth using for C, but I'd be a little miffed if people went back and rewrote what happened.

C. When you say 'quite clear on what happened', how much is required to have happened? Or is the porny aspect required at all? Would non-sex-related-hijinks also be acceptable?

Color me confused...

(frozen comment) Re: Won't Be Joining this Comm Ever.

[identity profile] debc.livejournal.com 2006-08-21 02:01 pm (UTC)(link)
Replying again because something just occurred to me.

You said (quoting you) that the challenge is NOT to remix stories, just to write a mission report about a story, but if you look at this orginal post (the post introducing the challenge itself), the mod openly calls it a remix.

Quoting original post, with pertaining part bolded:

Everybody got that? See, it's kind of a Document Challenge and it's kind of a Remix and it's kind of Classified and Porny--or not; it's a festival, really.

Therefore, I'm not wrong at all in calling a remix, because the challenge itself (as written) calls itself a remix.

And still, I stand my original opinion that the people running this challenge have done so in poor taste and ever poorer manners by not requiring that people chosing the remix option gain permission first.

Most remix challenges I've seen so far only allow stories to be bemixed if 1) the author is question is also particiapting in the remix themself and 2) if said author has listed the fic as something they don't care if it gets remixed.

This challenge says that anything, regardless of if the author is a member of this comm, is up for grabs without permission or even prior knowledge from the original author and that is what I find objectionable about the whole thing.

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(Anonymous) 2006-08-21 02:03 pm (UTC)(link)
While I think this sounds like a fun challenge, I'm mystified as to why it was set up in this way. If the norm in this comm is to ask permission before using another author's work (and if it isn't, it certainly should be!), then what exactly led to the decision to make this challenge different?

I'm not particularly touchy about my writing, but I believe that it's mine (at least the parts that are original with me, such as plotting), and to think that it would be condoned for someone would appropriate it without my permission is distasteful, because as someone else put it earlier, it's just bad form.

Get permission, challenge participants, or don't write the story. It's just considerate, but more importantly, it shows integrity.

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[identity profile] blade-girl.livejournal.com 2006-08-21 02:04 pm (UTC)(link)
Oops! This comment was from me, only not the logged-in me.

(frozen comment) It's not the permission... it's the remix

[identity profile] thefannishwaldo.livejournal.com 2006-08-21 02:05 pm (UTC)(link)

Okay, so I was trying to think about why this challenge bothered me so much... And this is what I came up with.

It's the remix aspect that has a lot of people, including me, concerned. As Mice put it, I don't want my stories turned into McKay/Sheppard like might be done in a typical remix.

I don't know about you, but *I* define 'remix' as taking someone's basic plot and changing a critical element - the characters, the ending, the setting, etc...

I look at one of my stories like I Dyed in the Field (http://smallwaldo.livejournal.com/16663.html) and I wouldn't want it rewritten with John being turned purple and then going home with *Rodney* (or Weir, or Hermiod for that matter) to snuggle and mess with the lotion. That would be remixing it.

BUT if someone wanted to simply write the mission report, sticking to the facts of the story as I have presented them, I'd be okay with that. The mission report would have to be gen, because in my story it's clear that Carson and John are together so there's no nooky in the field, and that would be cool. But if someone wanted to fill in the blanks on what it was that Rodney ate or what Ronon threatened the natives with before he got smeared with plants... that would be okay.

So anyway, because I don't want to be remixed, I'd ask that if anyone wants to do a straight mission report on one of my fics, that you please ask first. If you aren't changing salient details of my story as it currently exists, I'll probably give you my blessings and thank you profusely for liking my work enough to want to work with it.

But honestly, I don't suspect anyone really wants any of my stuff, so this is probably a moot point.

ext_134: by ladyjax (Default)

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[identity profile] ladyjax.livejournal.com 2006-08-21 02:06 pm (UTC)(link)
Hi,

Also opting out of option C.

Thank you very much.

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